Steel timing gear noise

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ESSEXV6ESSEX
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Steel timing gear noise

Post by ESSEXV6ESSEX »

I have a steel timing gear on my car whi h sounds a bit like a supercharger. I know they are supposed to quieten down after a while but the ones I have heard still sound noisy. It's a 3.0S Essex by the way. I have read somewhere about alternatives that are either alloy or different in someway. What are peoples experiences please with either?

Looking for advice


Thanks in advance.
Mark
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Re: Steel timing gear noise

Post by Mr B »

Hi mate,

I have had mixed results with the steel/alloy timing gears, I installed a steel timing gear to one of my cars and you honestly couldn't hear any difference in noise, on other occasions I have installed them and had some noise but nothing serious, the downside is the weight of the thing, from what I have read the weight can have the undesirable effect of placing extra strain on the front camshaft bearing causing abnormal wear although I have never personally seen evidence of this.

The alloy gear works just fine although in both cases I would recommend changing the crankshaft gear as well - a brand new matching set should keep any noise to a minimum, the alloy gear isn't as strong as the steel gear but more than adequate for most applications.

So its luck of the draw really, but whatever way you look at it a bit of extra noise against possible engine destruction I'd take the extra noise any day of the week and who knows you may get no noise at all.

Hope this helps

Wayne
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tazla
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Re: Steel timing gear noise

Post by tazla »

I fitted a steel one a while ago .did my head in !
So i changed to alloy top and bottom .i can still hear it but no where near as the steel one
ESSEXV6ESSEX
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Re: Steel timing gear noise

Post by ESSEXV6ESSEX »

Cheers guys. Where are folks getting then from? Is this one any good?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/352777356986 ... media=COPY
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Re: Steel timing gear noise

Post by Mc Tool »

Any way you could lap them in a bit ?
Im wondering just how consistent the distance between camshaft and crankshaft centrelines is . Bit of difference here must effect how the gear sets sound.
Just looking at the cam gear , specially if it's ally ,Im thinkin a bit of sound deadening would go some way to shuttin it up a bit .
Personally I like a bit of "engine noise" .....so long as its a good running noise ....not the bottom half of a con rod makin a bid for freedom sort of noise🙂
Sometimes I talk to myself ... and we both have a good laugh
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Re: Steel timing gear noise

Post by Mr B »

ESSEXV6ESSEX wrote: Thu Jul 21, 2022 5:50 pm Cheers guys. Where are folks getting then from? Is this one any good?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/352777356986 ... media=COPY
Looks pretty good to me mate 👍

Wayne
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Re: Steel timing gear noise

Post by Major_Tom »

In all the years being around Capri owners, nobody has ever mentioned this. Loads of folk talk about installing the steel timing gear to Essex engines, but this is the first time I've heard of any sort of downside.
I'm the one that leaves all those shoes in the carriageway.
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Re: Steel timing gear noise

Post by Mr B »

Major_Tom wrote: Fri Jul 22, 2022 1:31 pm In all the years being around Capri owners, nobody has ever mentioned this. Loads of folk talk about installing the steel timing gear to Essex engines, but this is the first time I've heard of any sort of downside.
This link is for the Essex V6 specialist Car Clinic, it mentions the front camshaft bearing wear.

https://www.essexengines.com/tuning%20t ... ge%205.htm.

Wayne
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Re: Steel timing gear noise

Post by Mc Tool »

Can see how a relatively hefty steel cam gear could cause extra bearing wear compared to a lighter ally one.........now that I think about it😁
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Re: Steel timing gear noise

Post by Mr B »

I've only had one timing gear break in 30 years, however, the mess it made was horrendous, it was a perfect storm really:

It was winter and freezing cold outside - oil like molasses in winter.
Kent V62 camshaft and original Ford timing gear.
Had argument with my partner.
Stormed out of her gaff and tried to start car.
Lost my temper when she was hesitant to start.
She started and one big rev later...bang tat tat tat..stop.
Open bonnet and remove dizzy cap crank engine and dizzy not turning.
Tow her home.
Next day strip front of Engine - no teeth left on timing gear.
Remove sump and retrieve all the teeth.
Sump back on, replacement timing gear, thought I had got away with it.......like fuck had I got away with it!!
Spinning engine over with a ratchet to set timing - hardly any compression. ☹
Eventually started up and was back firing through the carb and the exhausts - My late father did warn me the valves would more than lightly be bent especially with that cam in there - I didn't listen.
Removed heads - 7 valves out of 12 were toast.
Got replacement heads and all good.
2 lessons learned, 1st lesson, always listen to Dad, 2nd lesson, use a steel or alloy timing gear.

And to think the above is classed as 'getting away with it lightly'

God bless ya Dad x

Wayne
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ESSEXV6ESSEX
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Re: Steel timing gear noise

Post by ESSEXV6ESSEX »

Thanks everyone.

I have ordered a kit from Ric Wood. He says the kits he sells are dead quiet whilst the steel gears are noisy so it appears these are good and also not breakable.

Cheers
Mark
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Re: Steel timing gear noise

Post by Mr B »

ESSEXV6ESSEX wrote: Tue Jul 26, 2022 8:00 pm Thanks everyone.

I have ordered a kit from Ric Wood. He says the kits he sells are dead quiet whilst the steel gears are noisy so it appears these are good and also not breakable.

Cheers
Mark
Dare I ask how much the kit was....
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Re: Steel timing gear noise

Post by ESSEXV6ESSEX »

Mr B wrote: Tue Jul 26, 2022 10:19 pm
ESSEXV6ESSEX wrote: Tue Jul 26, 2022 8:00 pm Thanks everyone.

I have ordered a kit from Ric Wood. He says the kits he sells are dead quiet whilst the steel gears are noisy so it appears these are good and also not breakable.

Cheers
Mark
Dare I ask how much the kit was....
£235 Inc postage. There is one on ebay at £205 but ebay is ebay isn't it. Could be the same one though. Its at home so when I get home this evening I will take a pic and post it up. Very fast delivery, over night really UPS
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Re: Steel timing gear noise

Post by Mr B »

ESSEXV6ESSEX wrote: Wed Jul 27, 2022 1:07 pm
Mr B wrote: Tue Jul 26, 2022 10:19 pm
ESSEXV6ESSEX wrote: Tue Jul 26, 2022 8:00 pm Thanks everyone.

I have ordered a kit from Ric Wood. He says the kits he sells are dead quiet whilst the steel gears are noisy so it appears these are good and also not breakable.

Cheers
Mark
Dare I ask how much the kit was....
£235 Inc postage. There is one on ebay at £205 but ebay is ebay isn't it. Could be the same one though. Its at home so when I get home this evening I will take a pic and post it up. Very fast delivery, over night really UPS
I think that's a good price to be honest mate especially as it could save your engine from being totalled if the original gear broke.

Wayne
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Re: Steel timing gear noise

Post by ESSEXV6ESSEX »

Mr B wrote: Wed Jul 27, 2022 4:04 pm
ESSEXV6ESSEX wrote: Wed Jul 27, 2022 1:07 pm
Mr B wrote: Tue Jul 26, 2022 10:19 pm

Dare I ask how much the kit was....
£235 Inc postage. There is one on ebay at £205 but ebay is ebay isn't it. Could be the same one though. Its at home so when I get home this evening I will take a pic and post it up. Very fast delivery, over night really UPS
I think that's a good price to be honest mate especially as it could save your engine from being totalled if the original gear broke.

Wayne
Yeah it's one of those isn't it. Look how many are still running fibre so it depends who you believe but I chose to replace mine with a steel one as thats what was available when my engine was rebuilt. Its bloody noisy like a supercharger and ruins the burble of the essex. I also heard the steel ones have straight cut teeth and can weigh heavy on the camshaft front bearing. I honestly don't know, I just hate the whine. For these reasons I decided to get it changed. Ric Wood seems to be the man but then some have criticised him. Me, well I'm certainly not going to. He was very helpful and ringing up and paying for it was straight forward. I would sooner buy it from somebody reputable then ebay. I will get it fitted and keep people informed.

All the best
Mark.
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Re: Steel timing gear noise

Post by Mr B »

ESSEXV6ESSEX wrote: Wed Jul 27, 2022 6:01 pm
Mr B wrote: Wed Jul 27, 2022 4:04 pm
ESSEXV6ESSEX wrote: Wed Jul 27, 2022 1:07 pm

£235 Inc postage. There is one on ebay at £205 but ebay is ebay isn't it. Could be the same one though. Its at home so when I get home this evening I will take a pic and post it up. Very fast delivery, over night really UPS
I think that's a good price to be honest mate especially as it could save your engine from being totalled if the original gear broke.

Wayne
Yeah it's one of those isn't it. Look how many are still running fibre so it depends who you believe but I chose to replace mine with a steel one as thats what was available when my engine was rebuilt. Its bloody noisy like a supercharger and ruins the burble of the essex. I also heard the steel ones have straight cut teeth and can weigh heavy on the camshaft front bearing. I honestly don't know, I just hate the whine. For these reasons I decided to get it changed. Ric Wood seems to be the man but then some have criticised him. Me, well I'm certainly not going to. He was very helpful and ringing up and paying for it was straight forward. I would sooner buy it from somebody reputable then ebay. I will get it fitted and keep people informed.

All the best
Mark.

I believe there were 2 types of the original gear, the early type was completely nylon and was replaced - the later type was metal with nylon teeth, I had the later type break on my car, age obviously plays a part but performance high lift camshafts and revving the nuts off the engine when cold especially in winter places even more stress on the nylon timing gear as the engine oil is so thick and if you add a high pressure oil pump into the equation it can spell disaster, I'm not sure whether changing the timing gear at certain intervals was ever recommended by Ford like for example the timing belt on a Pinto engine but if I ever bought another Essex engined Capri the first thing I'd do is whip off the timing cover and have a serious look at that gear!

Wayne
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Re: Steel timing gear noise

Post by SCP440 »

I had one go in the 80s on my first Capri, I was doing about 80mph in the outside lane of the M1, there was a lot of noise and suddenly no oil pressure and no power, I drifted into the hard sholder. It was a Friday night and I had to wait 4 hours to be recovered by the RAC to a local garage who just said it will need a new engine, I had it moved to my house about a week later and when I stipped it everything was either bent or broken. I put it back together and got an exchange refurbished engine for £450 ( those were the days}.

When I bought this one the first thing I did was to check it had a metal gear.
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Re: Steel timing gear noise

Post by Major_Tom »

So I guess the takeaway from all this is .. Metal Gear Solid 🙃
I'm the one that leaves all those shoes in the carriageway.
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Re: Steel timing gear noise

Post by Mr B »

Major_Tom wrote: Sat Jul 30, 2022 11:25 am So I guess the takeaway from all this is .. Metal Gear Solid 🙃
Jesus! That is terrible lol
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