Bodies 3.0S

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Andrew 2.8i
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Re: Bodies 3.0S

Postby Andrew 2.8i » Mon Mar 21, 2016 5:25 pm

Andyonthejob wrote:So what i`d like to know is how many panels can be replaced before, in most peoples minds, and over what period of time, the original shell has lost its true identity ?

That's an interesting question, and I suspect there is no definitive answer.

Andrew.
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Re: Bodies 3.0S

Postby andyd » Mon Mar 21, 2016 6:07 pm

I didn't think I was opening up this mass debate when I posted the first link.... :lol:

It's now on Car and Classic too.

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Re: Bodies 3.0S

Postby paddy2010 » Wed Mar 23, 2016 9:31 pm

Dealers reshell cars when written off don't see the big issue u can buy a shell for any new ford and if they sold capri ones everyone would buy them people just always have an issue with somethings if u restore any old ford rite u cut 50 percent or more away

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Re: Bodies 3.0S

Postby Caprigear » Wed Mar 23, 2016 10:10 pm

Define originality, chances are that there aren't any original Capris that are still being used. Granted, there are ones that have never seen a road but aside from those few there won't be any car that is as it left the factory.
These subjects always create debate whenever they're raised. I see that there are new Escort MK2 shells being produced.
Are people seriously saying that if such an item were ever produced for the Capri (I can't ever see it happening) that they would not be snapped up by people wanting to build a car to last as long as possible?
Every Car that I work on has hidden horrors, general rot, previous bodges, poorly repaired accident damage and so on. There isn't the range of panels produced for the Capri as there is for other models so if people want the car to survive what can be done? If Capris had the same choice of repair panels as other cars then life would be a lot easier.
If a car has the original interior, engine, gearbox, suspension ,wheels etc then how is it any less of a car for being built into a new shell than one with the original shell consisting of 90% replacement panels.
If the cars are to survive long term then the bodies have to be the best that is possible - everything else can be refurbished or rebuilt but without a decent body to hang it all onto then it's a waste of time.
It's not about reshelling a car to try to con people, that's a totally different subject, buyers have to do their research before taking the plunge, it's about long term preservation of the cars.
That's my take on it, I know others will disagree, that's why I just keep my head down and get on with it.
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Re: Bodies 3.0S

Postby turbo-mike » Wed Mar 23, 2016 10:12 pm

paddy2010 wrote:Dealers reshell cars when written off don't see the big issue u can buy a shell for any new ford and if they sold capri ones everyone would buy them people just always have an issue with somethings if u restore any old ford rite u cut 50 percent or more away


You have answered you own question Dealers reshell with BRAND NEW shells not second hand that is the issue.

And just to add, no one reshells for anything but making money,
Proof would some one that had a rusty 1.6gl and a decent 280, then reshell the gl in to 280 and keep the gl I'd. I think not, but they would do it the other way round, whys that because a good 280 will be worth more than a good gl FACT
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Re: Bodies 3.0S

Postby paddy2010 » Tue Mar 29, 2016 11:06 pm

That's a good point but ill put pics of my 3.0s soon and it's new every part has been cut welded and repairs its not the same car any more don't see how reshell is any different if new panels where available mabe but we had to make most things rob my panel beater made them will i change it from ford capri to rob capri

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Re: Bodies 3.0S

Postby 340truck » Fri Apr 01, 2016 9:34 pm

It does say in the description - "and is believed to have been reshelled" but it is near the bottom and in brackets so you sort of miss it. It ain't the car that Lewis Collins sat in. Simples
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Re: Bodies 3.0S

Postby Peter-S » Fri Apr 01, 2016 10:15 pm

Andyonthejob wrote:So what i`d like to know is how many panels can be replaced before, in most peoples minds, and over what period of time, the original shell has lost its true identity ?

Andy


Tricky isn't it!

My thing is old aeroplanes but if you look at those that fly, apart from the data plate most have hardly any original parts but they keep the original identity on the basis that the worn out/missing/unsafe parts have to be replaced for safety reasons.

Years ago I was on HMS Victory, which of course was shot to bits at Trafalgar and loads has rotted over the years. There is still some original Victory there but not much but it's still HMS Victory. It's not the old name on a new build of course but where would you draw the line if even more of the original has to be replaced. I guess if the spirit of the original is there then that's enough, possibly!
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Re: Bodies 3.0S

Postby turbo-mike » Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:38 pm

Peter-S wrote:
Andyonthejob wrote:So what i`d like to know is how many panels can be replaced before, in most peoples minds, and over what period of time, the original shell has lost its true identity ?

Andy


Tricky isn't it!

My thing is old aeroplanes but if you look at those that fly, apart from the data plate most have hardly any original parts but they keep the original identity on the basis that the worn out/missing/unsafe parts have to be replaced for safety reasons.

Years ago I was on HMS Victory, which of course was shot to bits at Trafalgar and loads has rotted over the years. There is still some original Victory there but not much but it's still HMS Victory. It's not the old name on a new build of course but where would you draw the line if even more of the original has to be replaced. I guess if the spirit of the original is there then that's enough, possibly!



Yes the spitfire that was found on Dunkirk beach and rebuilt, now as i have spoken to many of the flight crew and ground staff of the RAF memorial flight they say the same thing,as long as 1 piece of the original plane is kept it is still regarded as original rather than a recreation of the original, but as they say unlike a car if something brakes you can't just pullover on to the hard shoulder, now the thing with HMS Victory think if they reshelled it in to the warrior as it was cheaper to do so and called it the Victory then that would be wrong least it is an ongoing refitt I believe the masts are now fiberglass not oak and nun of the cannons ever fired a shot at Trafalgar.
Now how about this one Jaguar found when they made the D type hag they allocated vin numbers but stopped I think it was 5 short, so last year Jaguar built the remaining cars to the same spec as the original cars, now places like goodwood festival of speed won't recognise the cars as original but they say they are replicas. Well I see there point but if a car is made by the original car manufacturer is it not original as it is built exactly the same as the proper cars only difference is the build date, for me it is original but has no historic value.
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Re: Bodies 3.0S

Postby ESSEXV6ESSEX » Sat Apr 02, 2016 9:44 pm

Difficult on the Jaguar front. I saw a programme on that and the only difference I cam see is that as Mike says no historical value, it needs to be of its time. It's like building a cathedral out of the same stone.

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Re: Bodies 3.0S

Postby 3 Litre Power » Sun Apr 03, 2016 8:43 am

What about SOO 6363 R ? The silver Mk2 3.0 S X Pack , it's being restored in Northern Ireland i heard , i've seen some pics of it
My Mk2 Capri Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/FordCapriMk2
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Re: Bodies 3.0S

Postby ESSEXV6ESSEX » Mon Apr 18, 2016 8:01 am


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Re: Bodies 3.0S

Postby Lez1962 » Wed Apr 20, 2016 4:59 pm

It looks like it went for £48,000 ouch!

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Re: Bodies 3.0S

Postby andyd » Wed Apr 20, 2016 5:14 pm

Lez1962 wrote:It looks like it went for £48,000 ouch!


Hi Les,
£55000 :o http://www.classic-auctions.com/15/section.aspx/455
It would seem not everyone is feeling the credit crunch :roll:

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Re: Bodies 3.0S

Postby Lez1962 » Wed Apr 20, 2016 5:44 pm

Sorry I was just reporting what was posted on face crack still a lot of money though.
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Re: Bodies 3.0S

Postby andyd » Wed Apr 20, 2016 6:34 pm

Lez1962 wrote:Sorry I was just reporting what was posted on face crack still a lot of money though.
Les.

Hi Les,
It was probably £48000 plus fees :spank:

Andy

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Re: Bodies 3.0S

Postby Andrew 2.8i » Wed Apr 20, 2016 8:10 pm

Hi,
A world record sale price for a 3.0S, by all accounts. Obviously the bidders weren't put off by the issues highlighted earlier in this thread.

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Re: Bodies 3.0S

Postby ESSEXV6ESSEX » Wed Apr 20, 2016 10:05 pm

I bet they don't know. Fact is if you sell something and don't declare stuff like that then the buyer has a right to get their money back plus any costs. That all changed or came in quite recently. When they find out will they chase their money?

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Re: Bodies 3.0S

Postby pbar » Thu Apr 21, 2016 6:28 am

This car sold for £53,760. Not sure who bought it but I'm hoping it may appear at some shows.

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Re: Bodies 3.0S

Postby andyd » Thu Apr 21, 2016 6:47 am

ESSEXV6ESSEX wrote:I bet they don't know. Fact is if you sell something and don't declare stuff like that then the buyer has a right to get their money back plus any costs. That all changed or came in quite recently. When they find out will they chase their money?

Hi Mark,
Here is a part paragraph from the listing I put up in the first thread: "The internet is alive with information about such hero cars and separating fact from fiction is never easy. Suffice to say that 'VHK 495S' is understood to have been extensively restored (and is believed to have been reshelled) in the 1980s, and further refurbished and repainted in its original shade of Silver some three years ago."

If the buyer didn't read it or research then that's their fault IMO :)

Andy