Drum brake cylinders and handbrake cable

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Caprigear
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Re: Drum brake cylinders and handbrake cable

Post by Caprigear » Fri Apr 26, 2019 12:27 pm

I can get the brake parts, and they'll be correct! all I need is the model and axle type.
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Re: Drum brake cylinders and handbrake cable

Post by D366Y » Fri Apr 26, 2019 12:45 pm

Caprigear wrote:I can get the brake parts, and they'll be correct! all I need is the model and axle type.
Thanks Martin, you have a PM

For reference the Borg and Beck ones I got have a part number BBS6158 and according to google is a replacement for the following part numbers so they should fit??


FORD OE-1560229
FORD OE-5015655
FORD OE-5019037
FORD OE-6079623
FORD OE-75AB-2200-CB
FORD OE-86AX-2200-BA
FORD OE-9079623

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Re: Drum brake cylinders and handbrake cable

Post by Mr B » Fri Apr 26, 2019 2:49 pm

Paul G wrote:You need to release the adjuster and push the shoes inwards. Using a small screwdriver put it between the adjuster and the round post on the lever and just twist the screwdriver a bit and the adjuster should release and pull the shoes inwards - if not twist the adjuster screw with one hand and push the shoes inwards with the other.

When this is done make sure the shoes look like they are central in the backing plate - if they are cocked to one side that can make drum refitting difficult.

Oh this all brings back memories for me - I remember the first time I changed rear brake shoes on my own as a 16 year old. I was on it all day and in the end I lost my rag and put a lamp hammer through the rear light in rage! I don't suggest you follow my example however!

Paul.
When I was in twenties (long time ago) I lost my temper with a 3 litre Capri that simply would not start, in a fit of rage I threw a small-ish club hammer at the engine...that throw of the hammer destroyed the dizzy, alternator and the carburettor all in shot, I felt sooooo stupid after I calmed down but luckily all those parts were readily available second hand at that time, sometimes the best lessons in life are learnt the hardest way

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Re: Drum brake cylinders and handbrake cable

Post by 340truck » Sat Apr 27, 2019 11:00 am

Can I just stick my tuppence in on this one....apologies if I've misread or not understood the problem.

If the brakes are assembled correctly, with new shoes, and the cylinder pistons are fully in, with the handbrake adjuster fully backed off (not as in the picture which I know is not of this particular query but does show the adjuster in exactly the opposite from where it should be) the drum will easily fit on without touching the shoes. It just will, Capris are simple mechanically and brakes are one of their simplest systems but they must be correctly set up.

So the long and the short of it is...something has not been assembled in the correct position for your problem to occur. Suggest you take it all apart again, re-assemble not from memory but from a Haynes manual and once assembled check against the picture in the manual - not from the picture in this thread which as I have said earlier is WRONG...the drum will not go on if it looks like that.

I feel sure if you do the above then the drum will easily slide over the shoes.

I know many slag them off but the importance of a good workshop manual (Haynes is just one of a few available but in my opinion the best) should not be under estimated. We all take short cuts but only once we have done the jobs 2 or 3 times and know from experience where we can. Doing jobs for the first time, follow the instructions in order, check with the pictures and diagrams and you won't go far wrong. I'm sure people will start throwing examples at me but as far as the Capri goes I have not found them ever to be factually incorrect.
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D366Y
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Re: Drum brake cylinders and handbrake cable

Post by D366Y » Tue Apr 30, 2019 7:37 am

340truck wrote:Can I just stick my tuppence in on this one....apologies if I've misread or not understood the problem.

If the brakes are assembled correctly, with new shoes, and the cylinder pistons are fully in, with the handbrake adjuster fully backed off (not as in the picture which I know is not of this particular query but does show the adjuster in exactly the opposite from where it should be) the drum will easily fit on without touching the shoes. It just will, Capris are simple mechanically and brakes are one of their simplest systems but they must be correctly set up.

So the long and the short of it is...something has not been assembled in the correct position for your problem to occur. Suggest you take it all apart again, re-assemble not from memory but from a Haynes manual and once assembled check against the picture in the manual - not from the picture in this thread which as I have said earlier is WRONG...the drum will not go on if it looks like that.

I feel sure if you do the above then the drum will easily slide over the shoes.

I know many slag them off but the importance of a good workshop manual (Haynes is just one of a few available but in my opinion the best) should not be under estimated. We all take short cuts but only once we have done the jobs 2 or 3 times and know from experience where we can. Doing jobs for the first time, follow the instructions in order, check with the pictures and diagrams and you won't go far wrong. I'm sure people will start throwing examples at me but as far as the Capri goes I have not found them ever to be factually incorrect.
Thanks for the thoughts Truck,I have been going by Haynes, and they are good, my only grievance is that everything says it should be so easy but it never is after 30+years of crap on it :lol:

I've tried buying another set of shoes from Tickover now for 8" drums which is what I have, if they work it must mean I have got either the wrong shoes completely or 9" shoes, will have to wait and see!

Cheers guys

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Re: Drum brake cylinders and handbrake cable

Post by D366Y » Tue Apr 30, 2019 10:46 am

So the shoes from tickover have just this second arrived - they are the exact same Borg and Beck parts that I ordered last week, but three times the price!

Part numbers are identical.

I'll take the shoes off again later and try and again I guess....!

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Re: Drum brake cylinders and handbrake cable

Post by Peter-S » Tue Apr 30, 2019 12:03 pm

Pop up a picture Dan - might be something that we can see.
ImageBanner by Peter Smith, on Flickr

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Re: Drum brake cylinders and handbrake cable

Post by D366Y » Tue Apr 30, 2019 12:28 pm

Peter-S wrote:Pop up a picture Dan - might be something that we can see.
Will do, cheers!

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Re: Drum brake cylinders and handbrake cable

Post by D366Y » Sun May 12, 2019 12:15 pm

Sorry for the delay - went away to Amsterdam for a week!
Anyway, tried again this morning and still no luck at all getting even one new shoe on, had my dad help me just to make sure I wasn't something and he was none the wiser either. Below are some pictures of the stage I get to but still can't get the drum over the new shoes at all...

Anything I'm missing please do let me know! There was no retaining spring from the top of the adjuster arm to the shoe when I took the old one off either but it was working fine before so I guess shouldn't make a massive difference?

ImageIMAG0343 by Danny Hassall, on Flickr

ImageIMAG0344 by Danny Hassall, on Flickr

ImageIMAG0345 by Danny Hassall, on Flickr

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Re: Drum brake cylinders and handbrake cable

Post by 340truck » Sun May 12, 2019 2:09 pm

I know whats wrong....I think. Anyone else know and want to say it first?
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Re: Drum brake cylinders and handbrake cable

Post by Peter-S » Sun May 12, 2019 4:26 pm

If that is the near side the shoes are the wrong way round
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Re: Drum brake cylinders and handbrake cable

Post by 340truck » Sun May 12, 2019 5:10 pm

Peter-S wrote:
Sun May 12, 2019 4:26 pm
If that is the near side the shoes are the wrong way round
Yes I believe they are.
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Re: Drum brake cylinders and handbrake cable

Post by D366Y » Mon May 13, 2019 8:14 am

340truck wrote:
Sun May 12, 2019 5:10 pm
Peter-S wrote:
Sun May 12, 2019 4:26 pm
If that is the near side the shoes are the wrong way round
Yes I believe they are.
:doh:

OK just so I am 100% clear - the one on the right of my picture is the wrong shoe?
In the third picture I even tried to put just one new shoe on and the leave the old one on - still wouldn't fit so would guess that's the issue?

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Re: Drum brake cylinders and handbrake cable

Post by Peter-S » Mon May 13, 2019 8:35 am

D366Y wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 8:14 am
340truck wrote:
Sun May 12, 2019 5:10 pm
Peter-S wrote:
Sun May 12, 2019 4:26 pm
If that is the near side the shoes are the wrong way round
Yes I believe they are.
:doh:

OK just so I am 100% clear - the one on the right of my picture is the wrong shoe?
In the third picture I even tried to put just one new shoe on and the leave the old one on - still wouldn't fit so would guess that's the issue?
The shoes in the first picture should just be swapped for each other. Hopefully this will then push the right hand brake piston home as it looks to be sticking out. If it doesn't move then perhaps the piston is seized which won't be helping your cause either.
Looking at it again you are also missing a short thick spring that connects in the small hole in the adjuster arm under the brake cylinder. Check your original pictures. This will pull the shoes tighter.
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Re: Drum brake cylinders and handbrake cable

Post by D366Y » Mon May 13, 2019 9:01 am

Peter-S wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 8:35 am

The shoes in the first picture should just be swapped for each other. Hopefully this will then push the right hand brake piston home as it looks to be sticking out. If it doesn't move then perhaps the piston is seized which won't be helping your cause either.
Looking at it again you are also missing a short thick spring that connects in the small hole in the adjuster arm under the brake cylinder. Check your original pictures. This will pull the shoes tighter.

Thanks Peter, will try again later tonight - 6th time's the charm!

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Re: Drum brake cylinders and handbrake cable

Post by Jasonmarie » Mon May 13, 2019 1:08 pm

Don’t eat any of that cake you bought at the weekend Mr Dan also I am still thinking how I can comment on your pictures of this weekend away . :lol:
Hope you had a good weekend break anyway :beer:
Ford Capri 2.0 Laser 1987 Mercury Grey ....... :beer:

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Re: Drum brake cylinders and handbrake cable

Post by D366Y » Tue May 14, 2019 7:31 am

D366Y wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 9:01 am
Peter-S wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 8:35 am

The shoes in the first picture should just be swapped for each other. Hopefully this will then push the right hand brake piston home as it looks to be sticking out. If it doesn't move then perhaps the piston is seized which won't be helping your cause either.
Looking at it again you are also missing a short thick spring that connects in the small hole in the adjuster arm under the brake cylinder. Check your original pictures. This will pull the shoes tighter.

Thanks Peter, will try again later tonight - 6th time's the charm!
OK so tried again last night - still no luck :crying:
I think the lack of that retaining spring isn't helping so I've ordered a new set of springs to come so will try again when they come - not sure how much of a difference it will make though as the handbrake arm itself is as tight as it will physically go so I can push the pistons in further but the shoes don't follow as the arm is as tight as it goes...

Will have to see what happens when the new springs arrive

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Re: Drum brake cylinders and handbrake cable

Post by pbar » Tue May 14, 2019 8:54 am

Are you sure the brake cylinder isn't seized, as Peter mentioned, Danny? I don't think the shoes will fit whilst it is extended at one side like that, your aim is to have the piston 'closed'.

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Re: Drum brake cylinders and handbrake cable

Post by D366Y » Tue May 14, 2019 9:44 am

pbar wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 8:54 am
Are you sure the brake cylinder isn't seized, as Peter mentioned, Danny? I don't think the shoes will fit whilst it is extended at one side like that, your aim is to have the piston 'closed'.
They both still squeeze in tighter so I guess it isn't seized? I'm no expert though (clearly :lol:)

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Re: Drum brake cylinders and handbrake cable

Post by Mr B » Tue May 14, 2019 10:05 am

Hi all,

From experience brake shoes that are fitted the wrong way round should not stop the drum's from going on in fact the shoes fitted back to front is one of the most common thing's I've seen even on well maintained Capris over the years, can you put up a picture of your brake drum(s) please

Mr B

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