Quick question regarding tappet noise

[Mc Tool]

Good to hear the cam is OK . To remove the followers just screw the adjuster ball stud down into the head as far as it will go and you should be able to remove followers , but either label them or remove one at a time as you don't want to mix them up . Generally tho , if the cam lobes are sweet them its unlikely that the follower is damaged ..... may be pick one at random and have a look . When running with the cover off they do flick a bit of oil about but how else do you verify oil feed to the cam lobes .... and anyhow it wipes off ....... dunno if I would stick a feeler gauge in there if its running .... unless you pushed it in against the rotation so it wouldn't be dragged in ...... #uck yeah ! that could get nasty real fast ... ha ha Im just getting a mental image of Homer Simpson doing it. Heh heh heh , if you want a real laugh google "Homers injuries"

[stevemarl]

Yes, obviously there`d be a bit of oil lost, you`d put rags down, but you`d do it as quick as possible, you`re just seeing if it affects noise. The oil will stop the cam dragging feeler in, it`s not going that fast, or push against rotation as said - it certainly won`t spit your feeler out & pierce your ribcage!
Just a thought but camshaft & followers should be replaced as a set as they bed in to each other, so either all new or, if a used cam, with the matching correct follower for each lobe. If someone`s fitted a new cam but used old followers that could be your problem?

[SmokeEm]

I have the perfect solution for you.

1. Remove head
2. Remove Cam & Followers
3. Refit Piper285 cam and new followers
4. Refit Head using a nice vernier pully
5. Run cam in properly and get it rolling roaded...

Just saying...

[Arya2.0S]

Yes, obviously there`d be a bit of oil lost, you`d put rags down, but you`d do it as quick as possible, you`re just seeing if it affects noise. The oil will stop the cam dragging feeler in, it`s not going that fast, or push against rotation as said - it certainly won`t spit your feeler out & pierce your ribcage!
Just a thought but camshaft & followers should be replaced as a set as they bed in to each other, so either all new or, if a used cam, with the matching correct follower for each lobe. If someone`s fitted a new cam but used old followers that could be your problem?

I have a feeling that's what someone has done, so that's what I'm going to check next. Think I need a day away from it though, it's stressing me out so I'm going to step away and come back when I'm not so strung out and less likely to make mistakes.
Cheers guys.

[Arya2.0S]

I have the perfect solution for you.

1. Remove head
2. Remove Cam & Followers
3. Refit Piper285 cam and new followers
4. Refit Head using a nice vernier pully
5. Run cam in properly and get it rolling roaded...

Just saying...

In an ideal world where budget were no problem I'd agree.

[pbar]

Think I need a day away from it though, it's stressing me out so I'm going to step away and come back when I'm not so strung out.

Very wise that is, with a lot of problems.

[Arya2.0S]

Think I need a day away from it though, it's stressing me out so I'm going to step away and come back when I'm not so strung out.

Very wise that is, with a lot of problems.

Yep. Plus when i get stressed i end up losing my temper much quicker or end up having a meltdown so dont want to end up breaking something in a fit of rage and causing even more problems. Plus the weather is supposed to be a bit nicer tomorrow anyhow (or so they say) .

[pbar]

Think I need a day away from it though, it's stressing me out so I'm going to step away and come back when I'm not so strung out.

Very wise that is, with a lot of problems.

Yep. Plus when i get stressed i end up losing my temper much quicker or end up having a meltdown so dont want to end up breaking something

Yes, and it really is horrid when you get into that sense of rushing to get something done, and it isn't working out, you're stressing, sweating, fretting, it goes from bad to worse so you rush some more.... really is the best thing to just leave it for another day!

[Peter-S]

You say that you use the car daily so does that mean you check the gaps after using the car during the day? It really needs to be left overnight to be properly cold.
What position is the cam lobe in when you insert the feeler gauge, roughly 12 o'clock?

[Arya2.0S]

You say that you use the car daily so does that mean you check the gaps after using the car during the day? It really needs to be left overnight to be properly cold.
What position is the cam lobe in when you insert the feeler gauge, roughly 12 o'clock?

Yep been checking them when the engine is dead cold first thing (well, first thing for me lol) I've made sure I've done all this before I had to use it because I know there's a difference between checking them when cold vs hot.
All valves are off cam when I'm checking them, rotating the engine by hand as I go, even been checking them according to the firing sequence of the pistons.
I'm doing everything as shown in the videos and links that have been shared in this thread to a T.
It's just not making any difference whatsoever seemingly, Infact I'd say it sounds worse now with the clearances adjusted properly to .20 and .25 respectively than it did before I started messing around and when I first checked them there was literally zero clearance between any of them!
It sounded tappety then, more so than my old engine which is why I checked them and adjusted them but at higher revs you could barely hear anything, now it's constant no matter the rpm, only time it's quiet is when it's not running or barely ticking over at 800rpm or less.
Cold, hot, makes zero difference to the noise. Only saving grace is it still performs perfectly, at least it seems to, I haven't been thrashing it since I started this process since if the followers are knackered I don't want to do further damage to the cam by pushing it too far.
One thought I had was, though this is only supposed to be a standard aftermarket cam, what if it's had a regrind?
If it has more material on each cam lobe than a standard cam would, then setting the clearance to standard tolerances wouldn't work?
Or is that just me talking nonsense? Is there a way to possibly test this theory? Like...Check for evidence that the cam has had material added to it? (not sure what the correct term is for this process but do you know what I mean?)

[stevemarl]

Please don`t bite my head off, and I apologise in advance , but you couldn`t have accidentally used 20 thou blades instead of .20mm could you? As that would give double the gap. OK, sorry, but you have to cover all possibilities.

[Arya2.0S]

Please don`t bite my head off, and I apologise in advance , but you couldn`t have accidentally used 20 thou blades instead of .20mm could you? As that would give double the gap. OK, sorry, but you have to cover all possibilities.

No offense taken, I've admitted multiple times I'm nothing more than a complete ametuer so it's a perfectly reasonable question, especially with my history of less than....astute decisions recently.
My feeler gauges are in mm only, they are by "Draper" same as these: http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/151230072884?_t ... mwBanner=1
Smallest they go down to is 0.05 mm. So I've been using the .20mm gauge and the 0.05mm one and combining the two to make the .25mm gauge.
I will admit numbers are definitely not my strong suit but I think I have this right...maybe lol.
No need to apologize I absolutely agree it's better to cover all possibilities first no matter how obvious or stupid they might seem, especially if I'm involved! Lol.

[fordperv]

When you set the gaps did you make sure there was slight drag on the gauges or did they just slide in and out with no friction?

[Arya2.0S]

When you set the gaps did you make sure there was slight drag on the gauges or did they just slide in and out with no friction?

Yep, slight drag on each one.

[fordperv]

Well it sounds to me like youve done it spot on, did you check if the oil spray bar was free flowing whilst you were there? I did have one pinto that had broken piston rings that sounded like it was tappety on tick over it still went like stink only found out by doing a compression check which made me pull it to bits and rebuild it

[Arya2.0S]

Well it sounds to me like youve done it spot on, did you check if the oil spray bar was free flowing whilst you were there? I did have one pinto that had broken piston rings that sounded like it was tappety on tick over it still went like stink only found out by doing a compression check which made me pull it to bits and rebuild it

The spray bar was the first thing i replaced when i checked them the first time, and oil has been changed very recently with 15w40 so i have no reason to believe it should already be clogged.

It was finally a decent day so had another crack at it, and an interesting development... while i was taking a couple of followers out i tinkered about some more with the clearances and after taking it for a drive its the best its ever sounded since putting this new engine in!
Still not perfect by any means, still a little too tappety for my liking on tick over but while driving you can barely hear the tappets and its waaaay better than before!
So im thinking its literally just a case of fine tuning, and user error. I mean this is literally the first time i have ever done something this "complicated" with an engine before, the closest ive gotten was adjusting the points on my old beetle so wouldn't surprise me if i just dont have the right technique down, or im simply missing the "knack".

My buddy who is a mechanical Stig is back from holiday, so im gonna have him take a listen and have a look and see what he says.

Anyway, just for prosperity, here is what some of the followers look like, these were picked at random and i didnt take them all out because effort lol. These are from inlets on 1 and 2, i also checked number 3 and it looks identical so didnt take a picture.

[stevemarl]

The brown stain on either side of the contact area on the pad, is that oil which will wipe off or is it actually discoloured?

[Arya2.0S]

The brown stain on either side of the contact area on the pad, is that oil which will wipe off or is it actually discoloured?

That's discolouration....Why, what is it?
I thought the contact pads should be a uniform colour based on other used followers I've seen online.

[stevemarl]

It`s just that that type of oil staining is usually due to years of use, and maybe not too frequent oil changes. If the engine was overhauled, new cam, followers etc, I wouldn`t expect that colouration. At the end of the day, the tapping is because there IS too much clearance in the valve train; the only moving parts are the camshaft & followers, if the camshaft is definitely OK then it must be the follower(s)? If you get hold of the end of follower at the valve end, how much up/down does there seem to be? Does it seem loose?

[Arya2.0S]

It`s just that that type of oil staining is usually due to years of use, and maybe not too frequent oil changes. If the engine was overhauled, new cam, followers etc, I wouldn`t expect that colouration. At the end of the day, the tapping is because there IS too much clearance in the valve train; the only moving parts are the camshaft & followers, if the camshaft is definitely OK then it must be the follower(s)? If you get hold of the end of follower at the valve end, how much up/down does there seem to be? Does it seem loose?

I dont think so, then again i never really checked for that type of movement before. I've only noticed the slight side to side movement. If i take the cam cover off again i'll take another look and see if theres any up/down movement too.
Cheers.