Are speed cameras safe?

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Are speed cameras safe?

Post by STEVEW » Thu Nov 12, 2020 8:59 am

Are speed cameras safe?

There are mobile cameras in vans, average speed cameras, cameras on open roads, cameras everywhere. Do we drive anywhere nowadays or do we go on a “mission” deemed successful if we haven’t been “whacked” by the points system?
Is too much time spent checking the speedo rather than observing the constantly changing situations on the road: especially in strange towns and areas?
In other words, is this proliferation of speed cameras becoming a distracting danger?
Money spinner they certainly are!

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Re: Are speed cameras safe?

Post by Jasonmarie » Thu Nov 12, 2020 12:12 pm

The bit I do wonder is when I am driving at 70mph on the motorway why is it that every Tom , dick & Harry overtake ?
We have a 50mph on the A2 at the moment and the drivers are still doing 80mph so I always wonder if they are really working ?
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Re: Are speed cameras safe?

Post by mgentry90 » Thu Nov 12, 2020 6:35 pm

*long message deleted*

We all know what the speed limits are, we all know we shouldn't go over those limits. If we choose to ignore the signs and the countless warning we get daily about it on tv, radio etc etc, we deserve to get hit with the points.

Don't break the law, then complain later when you get caught and get a spank on the bottom (or a fine).

Cameras are safe long term for people who live locally and know they are there really. If you know the camera is there are you likely to speed in that area or go slow?


However if you don't know it's there or it's newly fitted and catch it last second that's when the anchors come on and could be a problem. However going back to the first bit, don't break the speed limit and you won't have anything to worry about. Checking your speed should be second nature when driving and something you do regularly anyway. For us younger folk, it was part of the training and test.

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Re: Are speed cameras safe?

Post by STEVEW » Thu Nov 12, 2020 9:35 pm

"long message written"

mgentry90 wrote,
don't break the speed limit and you won't have anything to worry about
It sounds like you're saying, speed limits are the be all and end all. In other words a road, having a few gentle curves and which gives a view through these corners, having a speed limit of 50 mph - that's it.
On a warm summers evening with little or no traffic it would be perfectly safe to travel at 60 mph whereas if you choose to stick to the speed limit on a cold freezing day you could be endangering not only yourself but other road users by dangerous driving.

You also say,
If you know the camera is there are you likely to speed in that area or go slow?
I think you've inadvertently hit my point. Obviously there are people who slow down because of local knowledge and then exceed the speed limit once again after passing it so the safety aspect is questionable..

Further you write,
Checking your speed should be second nature when driving and something you do regularly anyway
How often do you take your eyes off the road to "check your speed"? In the blink of an eye a child could run out in front of you and you react too late because you have been "regularly" looking at the speedo.

And, as for,
For us younger folk, [checking your speed] was part of the training and test.
I not only took driving lessons with a brilliant instructor I was shown what you can do and can't do with a car by acquaintances who taught me to drive by sensing the car underneath my backside, through my hands and feet and reacting accordingly to the ever changing road conditions.
Clearly driving by one's arse (+/- 5 mph) allows you to concentrate on the more important things on the road and adjust your speed accordingly.
It's this feeling that a normal driving school cannot teach you.

PS. When you took your driving lessons did they teach you how to safely overtake (I don't mean a car turning left in a town); make you drive on a motorway on a foggy icy night in December, where theoretically it's 70 mph until you reach the overhead gantry; push a car to its limits and beyond?
Or, instead of braking, accelerating to "PAFF" :cheese: avoid an accident?

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Re: Are speed cameras safe?

Post by mgentry90 » Fri Nov 13, 2020 6:20 pm

Firstly what does paff mean?

And also, I don't have any come backs to what you said as both points as pretty valid.

Keep eyes on the road and risk speeding = kinda dangerous
Make sure you don't speed by monitoring your Speedo but then your intermittently driving blind = also dangerous.

Guess we are all doomed either way

Also yes, I was taught how to over take (safe or not, I guess depends who you ask) on an a road during my "pass plus"

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Re: Are speed cameras safe?

Post by Mc Tool » Fri Nov 13, 2020 8:27 pm

I have a gps radar detector , took a while to learn to work with it . I have had one speeding ticket in the last 20 years and that was driving the new car home ( yeah ,wouldnt ya know :burnout: ) before I fitted the detector . Wouldnt be without it ,not that I speed everywhere but I like to know where the revenue collectors :wank: :wank: are .
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Re: Are speed cameras safe?

Post by ESSEXV6ESSEX » Fri Nov 13, 2020 10:33 pm

Always an interesting debate.
As suggested if people with local knowledge slow down for speed cameras but then speed up to and beyond it, are cameras working? I would argue in that instance no. If they are at an accident black spot or a school then what is the alternative I suppose. It all boils down to personal responsibility. Through the DSA we all, no matter when we passed have aknowledged in order to pass that we know how to recognise speed limits, changes of conditions and the environment. A lot of this can be down to a subjective test which is why we have a recognised standard. It is our own personal responsibility everytime we jump in a car to keep ourselves, other road users and other people and thier property safe and where we don't do then there has to be a penalty, not always a financial one but a set of rules for a set of circumstances. Speed limits are on roads for good reason and its about respecting others through their professionalism to give us as road users and others as citizens the opportunity and human right to be safe in whatever environment we are in. That responsibility is on us all. If you choose through lack of concentration or ignorance to go against the rules then nobody can moan when your failure is addressed. If you choose to speed up and slow down for cameras either side of them then to me there is a higher state of culpability as you have clearly aknowledged the speed limit of the road but chosen to ignore it, but if you just through a lack of concentration don't see the signs etc then I would argue less so. If however you do end up causing somebody serious injury or serious damage to property or god forbid death then there has to be a common sense level to sentence and a base ground for a starting point which there is. Whether this is right or not is another debate. I hear people say on clear road etc where I can see is it okay to speed, well no it isn't becauae we aren't allowed and you can"t be 100% certain you haven't missed someone else making an error of judgement. Should we have flexible speed limits? Well again another one for debate. Whether we need to look constantly at our speeds etc, the argument there would be that millions of similar journeys are taken everyday along the same routes but only a very small minority ever get speeding tickets, now either some of us are not able to do this or the others have supersonic powers, I would suggest it's not the latter and if you don't feel safe being able to do this maybe don't go above 30 by means of a limiter or don't drive. That's not being cocky as we all make mistakes but as I say what is the alternative? I am personally not a fan of Speed cameras in the main for varying reasons. Simple answer is on all of this though, if you go for a poo and don't wipe your arse don't come crying when your underpants are marked.

Average cameras and cars that can detect changes in speed limits are on the way anyway so it will be taken out of hands soon.

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Re: Are speed cameras safe?

Post by Mc Tool » Sat Nov 14, 2020 1:57 am

My gps already knows speed limits for the area and displays it on screen , I can also set an alarm to go off at a pre set ( by me ) amount above any limit.
I would love to see the real reasons and figures for the death toll put down to speeding , like figures corrolated by some one other than the enforcing authority , coz I think a lot of it is bullshit . Politicians are bunch of lying crooks and this whole speeding fine thing is to good a cash cow , fuck the road toll just get the money , sort of thing for them to ever get honest about the figures. Isnt it funny how it always comes down to the money . The pollies always say its not revenue collecting but I bet if we could come up with a penalty system that worked better than fines (demerit points and disqualification ....3 strikes and your walking) they still wouldnt have it .
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Re: Are speed cameras safe?

Post by ESSEXV6ESSEX » Sat Nov 14, 2020 11:08 am

Mc Tool wrote:
Sat Nov 14, 2020 1:57 am
My gps already knows speed limits for the area and displays it on screen , I can also set an alarm to go off at a pre set ( by me ) amount above any limit.
I would love to see the real reasons and figures for the death toll put down to speeding , like figures corrolated by some one other than the enforcing authority , coz I think a lot of it is bullshit . Politicians are bunch of lying crooks and this whole speeding fine thing is to good a cash cow , fuck the road toll just get the money , sort of thing for them to ever get honest about the figures. Isnt it funny how it always comes down to the money . The pollies always say its not revenue collecting but I bet if we could come up with a penalty system that worked better than fines (demerit points and disqualification ....3 strikes and your walking) they still wouldnt have it .
Definitely a cash cow, I think people have done studies to show this. Still saamee old thing though they only go off when someone is speeding and speeding is against the rules so if you get caught you have to wear the trousers. I am not a fan of cameras for many reasons and I believe there are other matters of poor driving that I'd sooner address..

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Re: Are speed cameras safe?

Post by sierra3dr » Sat Nov 14, 2020 2:08 pm

Speed limits are there to keep everyone safe. There are those who can drive at higher speeds with good concentration and forward observation. On the otherhand,there are motorists who don't have such strong qualities for higher speeds. DVLA are not going to pick and choose which drivers are allowed and which drivers that are not allowed. We share the the roads with poor driving standards. On twitter,the police pulled up a motorist on the motorway with no lights on at night,the motorist asked the Officer if he knew where the switch is :banghead:

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Re: Are speed cameras safe?

Post by 340truck » Sun Nov 15, 2020 1:29 pm

The answer is in the terminology. Speed LIMIT not speed TARGET. It's that simple. There is no "justification" for exceeding a speed limit, if you do so (and I do, I'm not being holier than thou) then you must accept the consequences whatever they may be. That can be as simple as fine and points or as bad as a lifetime of guilt because you "knew best" and killed someone whilst exceeding the limit.

Take account of the speed limit, assess the road conditions and the vehicle you are driving and proceed accordingly. There will not be many occasions where your decision as to the speed you can do will be in excess of the limit. And, when it comes to being "distracted" by monitoring your speed looking at the speedo, I'm afraid that's rubbish. A split second glance is enough.

And yes, I am a professional driver so I do have an idea what I am talking about.
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Re: Are speed cameras safe?

Post by Mr B » Sun Nov 15, 2020 5:01 pm

All this talk about speed limits has made me think, I simply don't have the guts to drive fast anymore, I have a few 3 litre Capris some of which are really jazzed up and easily capable of breaking 130mph and yet when I get to about 80 - 90 mph my arse starts to flap, all sorts of thoughts start going through my head and that's it, game over, back down to cruising speed.

Anyone else experience this kind of thing?

Wayne

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Re: Are speed cameras safe?

Post by andyd » Sun Nov 15, 2020 5:07 pm

Mr B wrote:
Sun Nov 15, 2020 5:01 pm
All this talk about speed limits has made me think, I simply don't have the guts to drive fast anymore, I have a few 3 litre Capris some of which are really jazzed up and easily capable of breaking 130mph and yet when I get to about 80 - 90 mph my arse starts to flap, all sorts of thoughts start going through my head and that's it, game over, back down to cruising speed.

Anyone else experience this kind of thing?

Wayne
Yes had this for along time! Happy to sit at 60 but will go to 80 if required, anymore than that not really comfortable. Funny how we lose our bottle over the years, which is probably a good thing :)

Although I still like to win the red light Grand Prix :drive: :D

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Re: Are speed cameras safe?

Post by Major_Tom » Sun Nov 15, 2020 6:06 pm

Had mine up to 125+ the other day before I bottled it due to suddenly remembering my noisy prop shaft centre bearing... still had more to give.. the BMW got away. Once that's replaced though...

When significantly exceeding the limit lots of things go through the noggin. Most helpful, hence why I am still driving, not dead and not in prison. General rule if there is anyone else around, or conditions otherwise unsuitable, I don't go too fast.. anyone else not including the person you're trying to catch of course. Last good one was a Seat of some kind and a brand new Range Rover Sport. It was great, overtook them both and stayed there. The Range Rover driver thought it was the best thing ever, he absolutely loved it.

By the way I made all the above stories up as I am a fantasist and a pathological liar officer.
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Re: Are speed cameras safe?

Post by Mc Tool » Sun Nov 15, 2020 9:25 pm

sierra3dr wrote:
Sat Nov 14, 2020 2:08 pm
Speed limits are there to keep everyone safe. There are those who can drive at higher speeds with good concentration and forward observation. On the otherhand,there are motorists who don't have such strong qualities for higher speeds. DVLA are not going to pick and choose which drivers are allowed and which drivers that are not allowed. We share the the roads with poor driving standards.
:agree:
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Re: Are speed cameras safe?

Post by Major_Tom » Sun Nov 15, 2020 10:11 pm

sierra3dr wrote:
Sat Nov 14, 2020 2:08 pm
Speed limits are there to keep everyone safe. There are those who can drive at higher speeds with good concentration and forward observation. On the otherhand,there are motorists who don't have such strong qualities for higher speeds.
Somehow missed this insightful comment. It reminds me of my mate Caz, she drives a Seat Cupra, very quick. She was driving home one afternoon, at the standard motorway speed of 100ish mph. For about 7 miles she had a car a bit behind her, but kept her foot down in the usual way, until the blue lights came on. Yes, unmarked copper. She thinks, book throwing time.

Well he basically says that he has her at 103mph, but whilst he doesn't condone it, he recognised that she was in control and was following her for long enough to see she was competent at the speed they were going. He says he isn't out to ruin someone's life, but be careful, didn't even give her a ticket.

Not saying its a common occurrence, but interesting story that illustrates your point. If she had exhibited any other signs of poor driving during that 7 miles, she wouldn't be driving now.
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Re: Are speed cameras safe?

Post by Mr B » Mon Nov 16, 2020 12:13 am

andyd wrote:
Sun Nov 15, 2020 5:07 pm
Mr B wrote:
Sun Nov 15, 2020 5:01 pm
All this talk about speed limits has made me think, I simply don't have the guts to drive fast anymore, I have a few 3 litre Capris some of which are really jazzed up and easily capable of breaking 130mph and yet when I get to about 80 - 90 mph my arse starts to flap, all sorts of thoughts start going through my head and that's it, game over, back down to cruising speed.

Anyone else experience this kind of thing?

Wayne
Yes had this for along time! Happy to sit at 60 but will go to 80 if required, anymore than that not really comfortable. Funny how we lose our bottle over the years, which is probably a good thing :)

Although I still like to win the red light Grand Prix :drive: :D
Sort of glad it's not just me, perhaps that's the reason that Formula 1 is young man's game, as the driver's get older, have families and stuff they think sod this, I guess their reactions deteriorate as well.

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Re: Are speed cameras safe?

Post by STEVEW » Tue Nov 17, 2020 12:42 pm

340truck wrote,
There is no "justification" for exceeding a speed limit ... then you must accept the consequences
Exactly, and as someone once said, "Show me a person that says they've never broken the speed limit and I'll show you a liar."

Plus,
Take account of the speed limit, assess the road conditions and the vehicle you are driving and proceed accordingly.
:agree:

And,
There will not be many occasions where your decision as to the speed you can do will be in excess of the limit
Is the inability to make that decision or drive in excess of the speed limit the reason for what I call, “The suicide run”?
I think that most people on here have seen it at some time or another.

You come up behind a convoy of three or four cars doing say, an indicated 50 mph and the second car goes for the overtake. The road conditions are perfect and the straight is quite long, however the overtaker doesn’t change down and accelerate: instead he/she eases past at about 54 mph.
The time taken seems to last for ages and the safety margin is diminishing rapidly and you pop round the corner in your truck and there’s nowhere to go. There’s no going back for you nor the optimistic overtaker because the nerd in car number three has closed the gap to the car being overtaken.

In my limited experience: If your behind all this it’s the point to check the mirrors and brake accordingly

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Re: Are speed cameras safe?

Post by STEVEW » Tue Nov 17, 2020 12:53 pm

Major_Tom wrote,
For about 7 miles she had a car a bit behind her, but kept her foot down in the usual way, until the blue lights came on. Yes, unmarked copper. She thinks, book throwing time.
Interesting anecdote.
On German TV there’s a programme in which a cameraperson accompanies unmarked police cars on the autobahns.
There was on incident in which the police observed a woman for driving “slowly” in the middle lane of an unrestricted section of autobahn. She was probably doing about 70 mph overtaking trucks, which normally wouldn’t be a problem. However, she didn’t take the opportunity to pull over into the inside lane when it was possible to do so, thus forcing other drivers to move into the outside lane. (Nothing illegal – just plain stupidity or obnoxiousness.)
Shortly after the outer lane merged with the middle lane the carriageway becoming two lanes with a speed limit of 120 kph. Said driver remained in the same lane - which became the outside lane - where she reduced her speed to about 100 kph.
Of course the police were observing this and one remarked about two following drivers having overtaken her on the inside. (Blue lights on.)
Did the police go for the two drivers? No, they pulled the inconsiderate woman.

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Re: Are speed cameras safe?

Post by 340truck » Thu Nov 19, 2020 6:50 pm

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There you go Tom, current drive.

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